A company where craftsmen don't need a boss: Fero Baník (#190)
- Martin Hurych
- 29. 4.
- Minut čtení: 26
Can you imagine a company where there is no classic boss?
Where craftsmen don't need constant supervision because they make their own decisions?
A company where every employee understands the entire operation of the company - from the owner to the warehouse keeper?
Fero Baník built exactly such a company. For more than ten years he has been running Baník and Son, the word "freedom" is not just a modern phrase. In the company, he consciously builds trust, openness and commitment of every employee. The result? A team that thinks like an entrepreneur. A team that solves problems on its own and suggests improvements.
Fero decided to change the common perception that turquoise or free company belongs only in offices and among IT people. He uses the story of his company to show that this model can also be successfully implemented in crafts and production facilities. The journey has not been easy. It took years to gain the trust of the employees. But today, the company not only thrives in times of prosperity, but can also overcome crises. And much more effectively than traditional organisations.
In the interview with Fer you will hear:
Be inspired by the story of a company that proves that freedom at work is not a luxury, but a practical path to success.
You can't create a free company in six months. Not even by reading a book. Everything has to come from you personally. Otherwise, your company will be a sham and people won't believe your efforts."
Fero Baník | CEO @ Banik and Son s.r.o.
A company where craftsmen don't need a boss
(transcript)
Who is Fero Baník
Martin Hurych
Today's podcast is about how to build a turquoise or free organization even where your employees are hands-on and your profession is a craft. Today I've got Fero Banik, son Banik & Son. Hello, Fero.
Fero Baník
Hello, thank you for inviting me to the podcast.
How did he get his title?
Martin Hurych
I have two such opening questions, I really like your job title, how did you get it?
Fero Baník
I have a Ph.D., so I was wondering what I was going to write on the door, CEO or managing director, but it just seemed so stupid. The first rebrand I did was I changed the naming from Energoservice FB to Banik & Son and put on the door and on the business card that I was the son. I joke about it because the son thing is such a funny profession and it can go either way.
Isn't he sorry he ran away from robotics?
Martin Hurych
I'll go back to the Ph.D., you have a degree in robotics, you have a degree in engineering. You realize that you could have been a Silicon Valley star today given what's going on in robotics right now, don't you regret that a little bit?
Fero Baník
Not really. I've studied energetics before in high school, so it's such a blending. If I didn't go do what I'm doing now, I would definitely be doing some warehouse stuff, some automated picking, some fulfillment. The software that I did in that autonomous vehicle of mine, which I also made a physical model of and it was functional, it was straight into a somewhere, for example. So it could be applied very quickly, I don't mind, I enjoyed that and I enjoy what I am doing now.
What does Banik & Son do?
Martin Hurych
Banik & Son, come tell us what kind of company it is and how you and Daddy got into it.
Fero Baník
It is a plumbing company, we do technical equipment of buildings, i.e. heating, cooling, ventilation, renewable energy, photovoltaics. You can say everything that is technical equipment of the building outside of the wiring, we don't do the wiring now. I think we will them at some point in the future because half of the company are electricians, but for now it makes sense to save the planet a little bit with the installations of those things that we do.
Martin Hurych
How many are you?
Fero Baník
I never know exactly. We're somewhere between 50-60, we've taken on three colleagues now, so I didn't count.
Why did he start building a freelance business in the trades?
Martin Hurych
The reason I invited Fer is as follows. As I walk through companies, I am currently seeing such disillusionment with companies that call themselves turquoise or free. In the firms that I'm in, the owners have tried to build these firms primarily in IT or around white collar. Fero is a person who has been actively building a company with a horizontal management style in the trades for 11 years. What gave you the idea in the first place?
Fero Baník
That's such an interesting discipline because the task is so much more interesting when it's not done with ijts, but it's done with assemblers because there are more of those nullances. What led us to do it was that I wanted to have peace of mind, I wanted to make sure that nobody called me all day. This company was smaller when I here full-timing because I've been employed here since about 2002 on a contract, but so 2011 I came in that I was going to be here full-timing and that's when I started taking over from my dad. What I saw there was that it didn't quite work, I just wanted it so that when somebody got out of our car in our overalls, they acted exactly the same as if I'd got out in those overalls. It is just that when somebody starts to deal with it, they come to the point where they realise that the employee is committed and can solve any problem as if they were the entrepreneur. That's all that really matters.
How to turn a craftsman into an engaged employee?
Martin Hurych
You make it sound so simple, but the practice is much more complicated. For you, where is the or the tipping point where craftspeople, who very often consider themselves as people who don't care about engagement, start to turn into an engaged employee under your hands?
Fero Baník
What those managers are taking from our story is such structural stuff that, well, we'll calculate it here, we'll show it to them and they'll understand. They don't get it. The absolutely hardest thing is to build the confidence that they do the questionnaire, they will write the truth. If I don't have the trust, they won't even write the truth, so they're afraid to write something in there, so start to raise that level of trust and then measure it in some way and pull them from 20% trust to somewhere above 90%. In our company, they have 94% trust with each other, but also with other departments in that company.
This is absolutely essential, because if that trust is not there, that they don't trust the taboos or some other things that are being said to them, then it's awfully hard to do anything. You tell them something, they'll go outside for a cigarette and they'll think their own thing. But that takes a long time, that's not instant soup, because that's what everybody thinks too, that I'll buy a book, read it and in six months I've got it. I've seen companies that have transformed themselves in half a year, but for those assemblers it takes a long time. It took me about 3 years to establish a basic level of trust, so you have to continuously communicate the truth, the unclouded truth.
When they communicate and communicate over and over again, they need to relive the stories where they verify that what that Fero said was true. Eventually, it starts to lift there and kicks in, so when someone is not doing well, they most likely have trust at some low level. There's no trust and they can't even measure it objectively because they don't even trust the questionnaire they're supposed to write in to say they don't trust it.
How to measure trust in a company?
Martin Hurych
How is trust measured by the questionnaire? How do you know that they are not just writing you what you want to read?
Fero Baník
When I have a business within 10 Oudie, it can still be done differently there. We also have such ideal place mentors because it comes from some tool we use to do it. These mentors have a level of trust +1, there is a fitter here who is on a confidence level like the others, but he still has +1 and he can be that middle man. He can be that litmus test and he can verify that what he wrote on the questionnaire is also what he says on the cigarette outside. There has to be someone like that who is still in between. We now have a questionnaire every 2 months where we measure it, we look at different metrics and what comes out worst we address. Each one of those groups has that mentor and then they also all get together, I come in there as well, and they share those things that they need to change. Doing some measuring and asking Oudí and then not taking any action, it breaks that trust.
When I make a commitment that I'm going to write what I think is wrong in this company and then nobody makes any move, any corrective thing for 2, 3, 4 months, that's the road to hell. He won't write it in that next questionnaire because he doesn't believe he can ever tell anybody anywhere, so that's where you have to watch out for it. We verify it through those ideal place mentors who are still such an intermediary, because I also question that when I ask someone directly, if they don't give me an answer that is tailored to my ears. We try to do it even like that to get relevant results.
Why do you that the worker is only interested in the paycheck?
Martin Hurych
What I observe in the companies I go to is that the owner tries once, twice, ten times to build up trust and in the end, he or she resentfully states that the working class has absolutely no interest in the company's results or in what is going on in the company. All they care about is their paycheck. What do you think?
Fero Baník
That's the problem, he's got a hodge-podge of value-set Udi's out there. He has who are committed. It doesn't matter which color we say it under, whether it's Spiral Dynamics or Frederic Laloux, we're all somewhere, we've all been somewhere in our lives and we've somewhere. There are UUs who have also crossed over into that green band, which describes both of those theories in the same color, that that's the band of the community where they're interested. He very likely has some individualists there who are playing themselves, and those individualists are going to break it up because they don't care about the community total, they care about their own salary. Then he also has those who are even further down the line, either in the blue subUA of Spiral Dynamics or in the yellow subUA of Frederic Laloux, that they just want to have clear rules. It's 7:00, I'm starting to do it and here it is 3:00, I'm finishing and I don't care about anything here.
So he should start screening the value settings of his Oudis and if I want to have an organization like ours, we must not have Oudis from the bottom two bands because they will keep breaking it down. That organization has to come out of the person who is not value aligned, because you cannot have a horizontal organization without a head of a C-level Oudí made up of Oudí who need to have that dictator over them. He should do a value setting ascertainment of those employees of his.
How long does it take to build a free company?
Martin Hurych
That automatically says we won't make it to Christmas this year. What I see is the owner reads a book, gets passionate about something, takes two or three training sessions, sets company values and says from now on everyone will be turquoise, push it and it has to work by Christmas. I don't think that's the way to go. Is it?
Fero Baník
Absolutely not, that's not how it works. If we look at history, or if we look at much bigger organisations, Ricardo Semler, it took 17 years. Thomas Bata also thought how to employ those workshop workers on those workshops and figured out the same thing, but he didn't have it described theories, because there were no such books back then. When I look at it, I understand it very well, there are only two books that are of very great value to me, one was written by him when he was introducing operational accounting and that is Opportunity for All. This is the edition that he gave to his people when he was introducing operational accounting, because he describes exactly there that he already had profit shares and he was moving those people in value. When someone had 100,000 from the age of 14 to 24 and had a home, that person's values have shifted, that money is not of value to them because it will shift somewhere else. He moved those Oudis up one layer with that so that they could then begin to understand the whole context of that workshop and think about it differently and not be individualists. It's 100 years back and he came to the same conclusions, so you can do different things with it, but it's not this instant soup that I'm going to buy a book now, pour it over and everybody's going to eat it in the company and suddenly that company changes.
There are a lot of drawers that need to be solved, from payroll, wages, all the components of wages need to be solved then through some kind of shareholding, these are the higher levels of making it work in a self-directed way. There are a lot of those issues, I've seen companies like ours before when my father was still running it, running it the best way he knew how. If somebody wants to go down that road of wanting to do a turquoise organization, they should find out where the gros of that state are and then say I can replace them, I can't them, I don't have any other Oudis. If I want to change them, it's just for years. I've changed some of them here too and it takes 2, 3 to go from one to the other of that level, so it's for 10 years that project, if somebody wants to figure out I'll fix that organization that way.
After all, they don't all have to be turquoise, why should it be this way. Even 100 years ago there were parallel organizations that are blue, orange, green, turquoise, all sorts of things. Even 100 years from now, they will certainly be on the same page and be functional. When there's a church, for example, she's brutally blue, those are the hard and fast rules, no one down there can say what they think they'd like to do any differently. That's fixed and I believe it will be the same church 100 years from now because it was here 500 years ago and it will be here again 100 years from now. There will also be some Udians who will to do it differently. The problem is companies like ours where almost every single employee is in contact with the end customer. When I have an I.O.C. and I wrap packages, when I open the package, I don't get the sense from the package that this was wrapped with Acuity and love. It's just a package that arrived in time, so I'm okay. For me, this e-commerce can be kEasily orange, pared down, data, analytics, all under pressure and will survive, it's profitable, it's okay. We need that warehouse guy to not be upset that when is his shift finally ending at that warehouse because he can't run that fast with those packages anymore. We need an assembler who will step up and behave in an orderly manner to that customer that is our competitive advantage over the competition. But nowhere does it say we all have to be turquoise now.
What is Fero's personal motivation for free enterprise?
Martin Hurych
You say it's for 10 years, so there has to be a strong vision and a strong appetite of that business owner to build that structure. You put it humorously by saying that you don't want to solve problems and I figured that
you don't have to deal with the problems anyway if you put in a CEO to deal with the whole structure . What's your personal motivation to build that structure when it takes so long and it's clearly not the easiest path to success?
Fero Baník
I'm sitting here in a town called Vranov nad TopÚou, let everyone put it on Google Maps. The composition of the population is some, they are normal guys, but they don't understand the world around them. Those workers, those labourers or those assemblers have some kind of understanding of the world around them and it is limited. But that's okay because nobody taught them that, they're not taught in school what the cost of labor is, gross wages, net wages per account. They don't even understand these basic things, their family budget at home. So, my motivation is that if I can teach them to understand at least our little company, I have this little hunch that then they will understand the workings, that the whole state somehow works, that there is some value created somewhere and then that teacher's salary comes from that.
When someone comes and says that food will be cheaper, he will think how it can be, only the baker will have a smaller salary because he will not buy energy cheaper. If somebody is going to proclaim on the telly that we are going to do it that way, he is not going to be fooled. I think the world will be a better place, and those Oudis will look at those Oudis who are somehow different than them differently, because when they shift in values, they won't be like, these are the rules and this is the only way it should be. I believe that they will then say that if this one is black, this one is pink, this one is all sorts of things, then they will also look at the others that it's okay, because we are here in this company too. I want to have that impact wrench, you want to have the yellow screwdrivers, you want to have the red screwdrivers, we allow those People to have they want, to arrange themselves in their lives.
Martin Hurych
When I started travelling the world or when I started studying, I lost my friends from back then because that layer of understanding of the world opened up a little bit higher. So I wonder if those guys in Vranov still have a chance to go to a pub and talk to someone.
Fero Baník
They certainly have. We have such an all-hands meeting and such a funny situation 2 weeks ago. We had it at a restaurant and there was a waitress there and she was looking at me all day that I was explaining something to them all day. Then we left the flip chart there, so I went back and it was just her. I asked her what she understood of what I was saying and she said absolutely nothing. I was worried that if she didn't get it, my folks probably didn't either, so then we went to see if they understood what I was saying and they said that their understanding of the world was already greater. The waitress doesn't understand these things, which are depreciation, this is what we put in investments, this is fixed costs, and our installers at least in accounting have that education a little bit higher. So our guys can already have a debate in the pub about why everyone can't get 30% more pay.
How do you know the person who will fit into a freelance firm?
Martin Hurych
If you gradually change and teach those people over those 10 years to build that structure, how do you know today a turquoise heating engineer, a person who fits into your structure?
Fero Baník
I'm wondering if I can talk about this on the podcast anymore, because I'm still not revealing it anywhere, but probably can. We have manufactured our own questions for this based on some of our stories that have happened to us historically. Those questions are such that both A and B are correct. In the first round of that interview, everybody thinks they're going to come in here and address what photovoltaics they've installed where, what they know how to weld with, and what technologies they use. Our Kate, when she does the first rounds of the interview, she does a pure value screening of that person to see if they fit us here or not. We have different methods for that, we also have a game with such tickets, so we learned it, it took us quite a long time to figure it out, but now we can do it very accurately. The last 10 Oudis we've recruited like this are sitting here beautifully and it looks like they've been with us for 5 years.
Historically, when we've hired somebody and then I walk into that office and I see the pissed off expressions, I know that the new person didn't fit in at all. With the assembly positions, it's like if we took an individual from that orange zone, he'd come in and start bragging about how he worked in Germany in these power plants and I don't know what. Those guys of ours look at that and say how does that matter. We do stuff here too and we're not going to brag about it. We'll get to know it in the interview, we'll give him some of our stories of what happened, ask what he would do, this or that, and it looks like both A and B, that's the right answer. She's also correct, but when he's values-wise where we want him, he'll say B, when he says A, we know he's not ready for that. We have the advantage of having a pretty big influx of those resumes, so we can reserve the ones that fit.
How do you keep a company free when things aren't going well?
Martin Hurych
I watch around me that the boom of turquoise or freelance companies was a lot around Covid or in the times when, for example, IT people were doing very well. The moment the company stopped doing well, internally that turquoise structure started to get tested a lot and in a lot of companies those relationships deteriorated a lot. People started going against each other and started acting like if it was good, we were a community, but now it's about my salary. Those owners were so cranky about it that they said if they ever built a company again, they would never go into a turquoise or a freelance company again. How do you fight that? If I correctly, your guys and ladies can see their own salaries, so it's a free company down to the very last screw or washer.
Fero Baník
Covid was fine for us, it was running, the Úudia were making houses because everybody needed somewhere to renovate and live. Then it was 2023, when the conflict in Ukraine started, when we had a huge demand. We had a lot more demand than we would have liked, we had to experience that as well, and last year, after the mortgages went up, that was exactly the moment for us. Now construction has stopped because everybody was waiting for mortgages to get cheaper again, until they realised it would never happen again and started building. This is exactly the equivalent situation now that there is no demand, well we needed them to be home. When it was falling apart someone either had those individualists in there or they didn't communicate that situation enough.
The situation may be that we need to shrink that company. I am looking at the level of understanding of those Oudis at that that we have a problem now because we are all in the same boat here and if we are a company like this and it really needs to shrink, somebody will have to look for another job.
I'm going to go to Germany for a year now and then come back here because the situation will change and we'll put that company back together and let's get on with it. There it is important that those people don't say I am an electrician, I am not going to do the drainage. There it is important that they are set up so that now the is like this, we can do the sewerage, we can get hold of some contract. We've turned the rudder on the industry, we don't like to do B2B because most of the time it's for construction companies that are not value compatible with us, but we turned the rudder and the whole sales started to deal with B2B. We took some industrial sheds where the work is harder, we welded big pipes, but we went all in.
If it was worse that the whole industry wouldn't go as well, then that company would have to shrink logically and normally some would leave. I believe that then in 2 or 3 years, if the situation improved, they would come back again. I won't employ Udi's if I don't have a paycheck for them because the company will go bankrupt, it will go kaput and the organization has to survive somehow. The important thing is just to communicate completely openly, fully, to tell those fitters, they are the same Oudie as the owners, they will understand if they believe it. If he doesn't have the trust there, if he lied to them about something before, they won't believe him that we don't have contracts now and that we need to take a pay cut. When Covid came in, my folks said we're putting all the variable wage components aside, we're staying on base wages so that the company can survive. We really shut down, we stayed at home responsibly, we didn't go do anything and that was their first reaction. Their suggestion was let's put all the personal evaluations, the variable pay, let's put everything aside, let's just keep what's really in the contracts as base pay and see what happens.
What all is subject to free enterprise?
Martin Hurych
Generally, free and turquoise companies are associated with company culture, benefits, transparency of salary structures, etc. We were talking about the fact that running a company in this structure completely changes the company. Where is the least expected effect, where you have
a turquoise company versus a hierarchical one, how far does this culture go? What might surprise a newcomer to this culture? You said that even software development is subordinate to this structure.
Fero Baník
That was because I couldn't find a box solution for a horizontal heating company. We've been developing our own CRM software and all the pieces that make it work for 20 years. We still haven't run out of targets, we're even now going to roll out other things this year that will support that again because we're going to scale that much bigger. I did one talk yesterday in Košice and I got a question there about whether we have GPS in cars. I've said to myself for years that fitting GPS in the car is a hit to confidence, because at first it sounds like I'm fitting GPS in my car to know where and how my chauffeur is driving. We now have GPS in cars, but not GPS for the car, we use the Hilti ON!Track tool. Those are like Bluetooth gateways and we have Bluetooth tags on our tools, we have 917 pieces of tools.
When I take the thing out of the toolbox, grab the case and put it in the car, it automatically gets transferred from the toolbox to the car. This supports that, so that we can then do the operational accounting, but there doesn't have to be anybody to manage or control it because it's done automatically, it reloads itself. It's got GPS in it because it tracks that if they forget a ladder somewhere on that site, they know we forgot it on that site because that Bluetooth gateway was the last time it was loaded there. When they understand that this tool is being used facilitate our way of operating, that there is no one above them to control them, then it works. They then understand that this is not for us to control them, for someone to control us, but to help us in the day to day of our lives. Every single thing like that, I have to be able to communicate why we're putting this in place, what it's going to do, what it's for, so that they, from within themselves, believe it and understand that it's not for them to control. I open up the app here and I can see who has this circulator, I need to get a hold of it, if we have 30 cars here I'm not going to call 30 people, I'm going to see in the app who has it and I'm going to call them.
Does the flat structure also affect the type of customers?
Martin Hurych
Ignition is a lot about strategies and trading. Does the flat structure have any effect on the type of customers you work with?
Fero Baník
Yeah. The things that come out of that are that those competitive advantages over the competition are just in the approach and the commitment of that individual, that installer right there on that site. It follows logically that our strategy is more directed towards B2C customers, because that's where it can bear fruit. The end customer sees that somebody is behaving nicely, giving them advice, trying to solve the problem and not saying, call the sales reps because I have nothing to do with it. That's what's driving us more into that B2C segment, that's why we're there. Where having a horizontal organization is unusable is doing plumbing for construction companies that are vertically stacked from a helper, unplugger to some foreman, construction manager, production manager and owner. There are 7 levels and that's where we're basically not even compatible anymore, we've even crossed that out in our strategy that we're not going to do for construction companies. Now some people convince me that there are supposedly decent construction companies, but I haven't seen one yet. We come in there, those guys of ours are normally open that, however, we have a problem, let us solve it. There's some construction manager yelling at them that I'm not going to sign this, I'm not going to sign this, and they're looking at him like he's crazy. There's a problem, there's junction, the pipes aren't going in here, so let's sort it out right now. No, I have to send it to the planners, they have to sign off on it, they have to approve it. We can't do it there.
Then we can still now open a B2B that is aimed at small curators, to whom we can give services that they can't have. There is also still a possible way there, because that again is communicating directly with them, so that's where our Audacity and how close we are to that horizon can be. On employer branding, it is also possible that we have quite a lot of service people, which is something that even most organisations fail to build a big enough service team, because those service people can do it on their own.
I wake up in the morning, go to service the boiler, get my money, go for a bike ride at lunch. Our servicemen trade that for me being here at a certain time, sometimes I'm on weekend duty, but outside of that time nobody calls me, nobody bothers me, it's organised. I have a time slot, here I go do one job, second, third, I go home, I'm with my wife in the evening. They trade that for having to do invoices on a Sunday and being in an organization where I want to be part of that brand, I do it professionally there, but I have my life defined exactly. This is what some of the much bigger companies than us can't do, they can't set up service people like that and that's how we can sell to customers that we have that service where there's a large base of service people who can go on Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, New Year's Eve because they don't mind. When there are a lot of them, if it comes out to me once every 12 weeks that I have a weekend service, once every 12 weeks I have a weekend service, he'll survive it. That way we can give a much better service and that's again to that B2C customer.
How to build a freelance business remotely?
Martin Hurych
I observe a lot that the companies know are in one location, you are building a branch in Bratislava. If I want to build a horizontally managed organization remotely or virtually, what will I encounter?
Fero Baník
Our biggest supplier is Viessmann, because now we are the biggest customer of Viessmann in Slovakia and they have wanted it for years because there is no such company. We said to ourselves 2 years ago that we have to find somebody so that we don't say that we are looking for somebody, so it is such a crowded task, to find a business developer in Bratislava so that we don't say that we are looking for a business developer. If we put it like that, the motivation would be there that this will probably have quite a big turnover, a few million euros, and we will live nicely off it. So we said to ourselves that half of Slovak LinkedIn is Bratislava, so we started sharing our corporate-cultural stuff on LinkedIn. That's how Riso, who is now in , signed up last summer. Value-wise, someone who has experience in building a branch like that remotely signed up and it clicked.
We had a few conversations so that we know that we are aligned in terms of values, that the motivation is not money for him, but the motivation is to build an organization where the people of Úudia are happy.
Now we're doing it on a slide, we're trying to transfer those there. Now we're doing a recruitment campaign those assemblers in Bratislava, so again we're going our way through TikTok and Instagram to find senior UUs who are value-adjusted to us. But they are currently working in a company that is different, different value set and they feel that they are not happy there. We will find those Oudis, we don't have them yet, but we will find them, so we will hit them and then we will take them, so we need to spill that culture out into the distance as well.
Then it is also interesting that by having it all open, it is clear that if there is someone in the east of Slovakia and someone is working in Bratislava, there is more purchasing power in Bratislava, so the variable component of the installer can be bigger. We need those who work in the east to understand that you have a smaller salary because your variable component is smaller because we have to sell it cheaper here to be competitive. Those UUs there will probably have higher salaries, not by a lot, I did my research, it's not x2, but it will definitely be higher. I will say that when you move to Bratislava, you're going to be in the model that's there, it's open, it's shared, it's clear that there's a lot of money to be made here. This is what I need, so that we understand each other, that those Bratislava people are not underpaying those easterners and those easterners are not underpaying for the fact that some branch is being built in Bratislava. Also, budget-wise, internally we have it that this is a capex expenditure for the first year, that this is actually our investment, which is outside what they are incurring in costs. He has to feel the assembler that the fact that we are opening some branch in Bratislava has nothing to do with what my salary is. They know this, they understand this, and that is important so that they don't feel that somebody is cannibalising on them. So there's a method to do it remotely.
Summary
Martin Hurych
If this podcast were to come down to the final few sentences, what should someone who wants to go your way and wants to build a freelance manufacturing or crafts company out of their own?
Fero Baník
We have already said here today that it cannot be done in half a year. It also doesn't work that somebody will listen to me here or read a book, that I will now take these things and do them. I'm a firm believer that everybody has to figure out from within themselves how I would do it. Then when it's from within, he does it too, he tries it, then he finds out that it didn't work, or he finds out that the questionnaire is good to give a week or 2 days to answer. Everyone has to find their own way. The good thing is that at that end, when he gets to where we are, for example, all the fuck-ups that are going to happen to him in that company will be resolved somewhere at that one level in that company. It's not going to go up, it's not going to land on his desk. I've heard that if somebody hires a CEO, if there's a really big problem, it still comes to the owners, they still run off somewhere on the board and that's the problem. The fruit of that is that those people will solve it, and there are a lot more people in the who can solve problems, I think, because we keep finding them. Every week we find somebody, so they are the that exist, the commitment to all those positions exists. The fruit then is that those people take responsibility for themselves and solve the problem, they just need to feel from above that they have the confidence to solve the problem. Any organization can only be as valuable or at the level of the person who is leading it. When that CEO is going to have chopped KPIs, OKRs and all just metrics and only performance is what we care about here, those UUs below him may be at a different level, but they are just suffering there. When someone goes in that direction, for me, it's a better way for the Uudstvo to work together than those that are structurally stacked on top of each other.
Martin Hurych
I couldn't have closed it better today. Thank you so much for sharing your experience, I'm rooting for you and fingers crossed that you make it to the 300 years you have on your website as your company's life expectancy. Thank you so much and may you prosper.
Fero Baník
Thank you very much, we will do our best.
Martin Hurych
If you're excited about Fer and thinking about how to make your business, even if you have a manufacturing or craft business, a freelance business, we've done our job well. In case, I have one request here, consider giving me a like or a subscription to this episode wherever you're listening or us right now. I'll reiterate the invitation to subscribe to my newsletter. All you have to do is visit my website,www.martinhurych.com/newsletter . I remind you that 1,400 people just like you are already subscribing to the newsletter at this time. I have nothing to do but keep my fingers crossed and wish you success not only in building committed teams, thank you.
